Forum:Expanded UWP (2017)

Forums: Index > Watercooler > Expanded UWP (2017)

How do the eggs get distributed? (2017)

User:Tjoneslo, I think we need to rethink the all eggs in one basket approach to the UWP for classic era and TNE. I like it, but it is becoming apparent that different pages for each time zone would be a better idea. I get a lot of negative feedback for that feature and the whole History & Background section changes between ages.

• Let's not dump the data, which is cool, but let's separate each era into a new page.
• Astrography almost never changes (although sometimes it does), but history and the sociographic features almost always do.
• Let's discuss, please.
  • Template:UWP
  • Template:UWPexpand
  • Template:StellarData
  • Template:StellarDataQuery
  • Template:StellarData.layout-world
  • Template:StellarData.layout/doc

- Maksim-Smelchak (talk) 19:21, 19 March 2017 (EDT)

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This is an old debate, with no consensus about how to resolve it. I view the text of the write-up for the world as more important than the generated infoboxes. So my approach focuses on this text, and relegates the infoboxes, and other generated text (e.g. Template:Starport and Template:Imperial Nobility) to secondary importance.

The Manual of Style/sector and Manual of Style/subsector advanced layouts have one approach to splitting the History and Background section by era. Is this sufficient?

- What is the default era for world articles? That is, absent of other information what is the assumed date of an article?

- If the world has data for more than one era, what is the data presented at the top of the main article? Even if this requires splitting up the UWP?

- If we are spitting the text (and the infoboxes/generated data) by era into separate sub-pages, how does the main article link to these sub-pages? Part of the debate we had was the extra click required to read all the historical data if they were on separate pages.

Tjoneslo (talk) 07:41, 20 March 2017 (EDT)

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This is where the committee approach fails Traveller.

There are so many damnable clicks that one more is really not appreciable.

The default is Classic Traveller pegged at the Fifth Frontier War so Milieu 1100.

Put a navigation bar at the top of each world-system article marking which era or milieu the bar belongs to. Multiple choices will be available for most entries.

Later MWM will want Galaxiad entries which will blow the standard data out of the water. Lots of stellar novas.

This is exactly how Star Wars and Trek handle the same challenge.

Just be aware that sometimes the fixed data, as in the Astrography & Planetology, do change. Planets get destroyed. Climates change. Nuclear winter. $$it happens.

Ultimately the fan friendly sections, as in the Nobility, Star, and Starport headers, are the most used and beloved of the data. Your hard work with core data blocks all too often gets nitpicked and all too often does not receive its due.

Ssteve's work recording UWP histories in Empty Quarter will one day be appreciated.

- Maksim-Smelchak (talk) 07:27, 23 March 2017 (EDT)

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> Put a navigation bar at the top of each world-system article marking which era or milieu the bar belongs to. Multiple choices will be available for most entries.

I'm not clear on how this would work. Please provide a link to the either the Star Wars or Star Trek wikis with a working example.

209.198.64.10 11:06, 23 March 2017 (EDT)

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Everything has changed with Disney: http://starwars.wikia.com/wiki/Coruscant/Legends

They appear to now be marking it through affiliation on the right sidebar.

Star Trek: http://memory-alpha.wikia.com/wiki/Earth

Star Trek appears to have followed suit.

Both sites used to have a symbol for each era. We could easily do that for Traveller.

World extension then era marker then entry... Like disambiguation.

- Maksim-Smelchak (talk) 11:21, 23 March 2017 (EDT)

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The examples you gave didn't really clarify your ideas to me. But let me try to explain what I think you are asking for:

* The base world article would be Era: Milieu 1116. This would include the sidebar (UWP or StellarDataQuery), generated templates, astrography for the specific era, and the historical information up to and through Milieu 1116.

* For the other eras, there would be a sub-page for each era, named per the era. So, for example: Regina (world) -> Milieu 1116, Regina (world)/New Era -> Era: New Era. The sub-page has the sidebar (UWP or StellarDataQuery), generated templates, astrography for the era, and the historical data for up to the current era.

* The final piece would be an {{Era}} template at the head of all the pages which would supply the list of know era's (the sub pages) with links via either icons or text or both.

Somewhat correct or not? Tjoneslo (talk) 22:28, 23 March 2017 (EDT)

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Exactly. Still have accessibility.

Each page would have the bar of available eras.

We should probably ping the inner circle about it.

If you even think it a good idea. I'll leave it alone if you don't.

But it would save you (us) much criticism from people criticizing the economic stats that are an amalgam of several eras.

- Maksim-Smelchak (talk) 11:39, 24 March 2017 (EDT)